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    Home Unlabelled Developer-friendly guide to the Google "associated account ban" - advice to an iOS developer thinking about Android (misconceptions and alternatives for developers) Android Dev

    Developer-friendly guide to the Google "associated account ban" - advice to an iOS developer thinking about Android (misconceptions and alternatives for developers) Android Dev

    December 08, 2019

    Developer-friendly guide to the Google "associated account ban" - advice to an iOS developer thinking about Android (misconceptions and alternatives for developers) Android Dev

    Developer-friendly guide to the Google "associated account ban" - advice to an iOS developer thinking about Android (misconceptions and alternatives for developers)

    Posted: 08 Dec 2019 09:11 AM PST

    I received a query from an iOS developer thinking about developing for Android - and his concerns about the notorious "associated account ban" practice (by Google).

    Since the exchange may be of wider use to new developers thinking about Android, I am providing it here - my reply and the comments others may post here should dispel some of the misconceptions about:

    • "associated account ban" what it is, and what it is not

    • where to distribute other than Google Play

    NOTE: I asked for permission from the iOS developer - which he granted - so that I could include his quoted text.

     

     

    Hi! I'm a junior iOS developer that was looking into branching into Android. If you don't mind, may I ask you some questions about the associated account ban issue?

    If you are just starting out with Android, i.e. this is your first account, you don't have to be concerned about the associated account ban issue.

    This only becomes relevant if you have a ban - then this ban is percolated to all the other accounts that Google can get it's hands on - ones which it finds "could be you".

    But sometimes it makes mistakes and can ban your friend, who may have opened his Google account from your computer, using your Wifi or from your home using your browser. There are examples of a company account being banned because their developer was banned, and the developer was banned not because of any fault of his, but because a friend of him had been banned some time ago for some previous infraction.

    These types of bans are possible to get reversed, but usually take a lot of effort, and usually not through usual channels - what seems to work is posting on medium dot com with a convincing blog post that gets viral, and then sometimes Google will reverse. There are cases of account reinstatements after one year, but often it can be a week to a month.

    In any case, this is needless disruption for a developer.

    Usually app bans/account bans DO NOT lead to a Google account ban - BUT some developers have expressed fears that this could happen. I can't think of a case like that - I have a vague feeling it may have happened once perhaps but can't be sure.

    But it DID definitely happen with Markiplier's YouTube fans - when he asked them to post emojis - and Google mass-banned a bunch of those who responded. Markiplier issued videos trying to get his followers' YouTube accounts restored - many were restored, but many weren't (may have been by now). This case was notable because these followers got their ENTIRE Google accounts - including Google Photos and other such personal stuff also account-banned. Thus was particularly egregious.

    The alternative to going viral with blog post is to have legal representation - your lawyer sends them a warning letter - supposedly that also works reasonably well. We don't have too many documented public cases for this - but many commenters on androiddev sub-reddit have said that even just having your lawyer send a letter to Google at legal@google.com (even though Google says it doesn't read e-mail sent there) - can get results. Again, I don't know of any particular cases that used this method - so cannot give much more insight on this type of appeal to Google.

     

     

    • Would it be possible to create a new identity separate from my old one? Suppose I buy a new phone and new phone number. Only use my mobile data and a new bank account to pay for stuff. The one thing I am not able to change is my location as I can't move out anytime soon.

    Developers have been trying to create new accounts after account bans for many years - at least from what one reads on various forums.

    So developers certainly do evade such bans - they seems to suggest using different internet WiFi, different Mac address for computer, different browser (so can't be tracked by cookies) and then using different credit card identity - so for example they may open an account in a relative's name.

    But if that relative is your wife - who resides in the same place - you are likely to be associated eventually - and wife could suffer the fate of the husband (and the associated ban wouldn't be removed even after divorce!).

     

     

    • Would not opening a developer account be enough to avoid having my colleagues getting associated banned? I have a housemate that got banned, while I was lucky to not share WiFi with him we still stay in the same location. Not only that I have logged into my personal accounts using the office computer and WiFi. I also roughly believe an ex-colleague there might get banned for his personal app on the Play Store in the future. Is it too late to do anything to migitate any association at this point?

    I don't know - we don't have the data to be that specific about whether a previous association between you and another dev (even before you actually created a Google account) would contribute towards yours (or his) associated ban.

    If you are very enthusiastic about your Android project - you can proceed without bothering about associated account ban - since it is unlikely to affect 100 percent of developers everytime, you could take the risk. If something does happen, you deal with it.

    But if it is low priority for you, and you would rather not endanger yourself, or your friends, you could consider not opening a Google developer account - and simply publishing on F-Droid, or even offering your APK via your website.

    It gets trickier if you were planning to show ads or have in-app purchases - for ads there are ad providers other than Google Admob - but often they ask where your app is published on Google Play. But possibly it may not be a requirement - for example they may accept that you are only published on F-Droid - though I don't know how this reduces "developer cred" in the eyes of the advertiser (and if they pay less for advertising on such apps).

    For in-app purchases, you could use payment processors like 2Checkout - which would allow you to process payments independent of any association with Google.

    2Checkout has wider country coverage, but you could try Square and the other credit card processing companies which focus more for U.S. developers.

    Some developers have anecdotally reported on androiddev sub-reddit that they are able to get good revenue for apps hosted on their website, and using third-party payment systems like 2Checkout etc. However, this will still be less than what you would get on Google Play Store (because of it's ubiquity/wide reach).

    EDIT: xda-developers also seems to have an app store - though you don't hear much about it on androiddev. But it may be a good alternative to F-Droid (if you don't want to open source your app):

    https://www.xda-developers.com/xda-labs/

    In addition to accessing the forums, Labs contains an app distribution platform for both hobbyist and professional developers. With support for Alpha, Beta, and Stable release channels, developers get the utmost in control. We also have built-in commerce for devs that want to earn money for their work, and unlike Play, where developers only get 70% of app revenue, XDA lets developers keep 100% through PayPal or Bitcoin payment methods.

     

     

    • Despite all this I still want to develop Android apps and share them with people. Is hosting the apk on my personal site the next best thing besides the Play Store? Are there any other app stores I could try? I know there's F-Droid but I don't plan open-sourcing my apps.

    Sorry if the message is too long. I don't see Google fixing this issue anytime soon and am just trying to find a way to publish Android apps despite the bleak situation.

    There are other android app stores, but because Google forces manufacturers to include Google Play (as part of the Google suite of apps) - it has so far ensured that Google Play remains the dominant store.

    Developers have anecdotally reported that they are able to get good sales on Amazon (not sure how it is these days) - overall volume is lower, but the revenue per user is higher, so the overall revenue is not bad, though still lower than for the version of their app on Google Play Store.

    As an example, the Chinese market is hard for non-Chinese developers to get into (because of the certification/documentation requirements) - but even if you do that, there are a number of app stores (4 or 5 of the big ones - none of them are particularly dominant over the other). This is obviously an outcome of the fact that Google exited the China market earlier (a decision they may regret, but it has also affected/led to app store fragmentation). Chinese app stores also often have clone apps - so you may find that there already is a version of your app there - sometimes with different ad provider inserted, and sometimes may even seem very different (I have never tried to install the APK from those stores, but have tried to examine the APK contents and found differences).

    So there is a negative to not having Google Play Store dominant - and there is a negative to Google Play Store being dominant as well!

    The Chinese market has another emerging player - Huawei - they have had an app store (App Gallery - which ships with every Huawei device as well - and which you can download using an APK as well).

    However, it has not gained much traction - the only reason I mention it is that it MAY become interesting in the future, since Huawei (for strategic/survival reasons) may have to invest in their app store at much higher levels now - in order to prepare for a future where they are totally excluded from the U.S. market, and cannot ship their devices with Google suite of apps (including Google Play Store).

    Given Huawei is a multi-billion dollar company with big ambitions - their whole company future is dependent on this one thing - and so it makes sense that among all the app store contestants, if there is one which will have added impetus behind it, it will be a Huawei App Store (App Gallery). However, their execution thus far has not been exceptional - App Gallery is still anemic in terms of revenue according to some anecdotal reports by developers on androiddev sub-reddit. However that could change in the future, if Huawei's App Gallery implements even more developer friendly processes (for signup, and for in-app purchasing etc.).

     

     

    iOS developer's response:

    Thank you very much for the detailed reply! I guess I would choose not to create a new identity and just publish outside the app store. Google's ability to track someone feels like more than what I could handle. Hopefully some kind of government regulation or third party competition would appear to knock some sense into Google in the near future. All the best to you and thanks again for your help!

     

     

    Asked for permission to use his quotes:

    Sure, no problem. Feel free to quote/rephrase it any way you like. It would definitely be a great help to others who are worried about the issue.

     

     

     

     

    FAQ - App Bans and Account Bans

     

     

    When does a lifetime account ban occur ?

    A Google Play account ban can occur due to an "associated account ban" - when Google thinks you are associated with someone else, and that someone else was awarded a lifetime account ban. That person's ban percolates to his associated accounts - i.e. you.

    Thus if you become lifetime account banned by Google - you become a threat to your acquaintances, and to your company (and should not be put in charge of their Google Play account once you are lifetime account banned).

    If you are not associated with anyone by Google - then your lifetime account ban will occur usually due to an accumulation of app bans.

    A Google Play developer account ban IS a lifetime ban.

     

     

    How many app bans are required to achieve a lifetime account ban ?

    The conventional wisdom some time ago was that 3 app bans were usually what triggered a lifetime account ban.

    But from anecdotal evidence from developers on androiddev, we now know:

    • a lifetime account ban can occur with just a single app ban (usually when you only have 1 app published)

    • a lifetime account ban can occur with your first Alpha app (one dev published his first app as an Alpha app - which Google considers as a published app - this app was banned for some reason - which triggered his lifetime account ban)

    • sometimes a lifetime account ban does not occur even after 3 app bans (happens if you have many apps - and some of them are seen by Google as high quality apps ?)

    • sometimes a lifetime account ban can occur as "one event" - these are based on a cascade of app bans (which happen in quick succession - usually because they all violate some recently introduced rule by Google) - this triggers an immediate lifetime account ban. As far as the developer is concerned, the series of events happens so fast that they seem to occur as one event (and there is no chance for them to stave off this attack).

    As with most Google "rules" which suffer from the info asymmetry that makes for a "moral hazard" in Google vs partner dealings (app dev/Adsense/YouTubers):

     

     

    Other observations about app bans and account bans

    • just as an app ban means a developer cannot get access to the information about his app (Description and other info he previously entered is now not visible to him), similarly if you are lifetime account banned, you lose access to the account information (which you may now need to mount a defence against Google's action).

    • app bans usually lack enough context for a developer to understand what caused them (this is an often cited observation by devs) - only in the simplest of cases is it clear what the cause was (in such cases Google DOES provlde a screenshot sometimes with the e-mail that makes clear (for example a button that takes user to your Google Play app page is not labelled). However, they will not tell you what to do to fix it - for this particular case, you need to add text "My Apps" or "Our Apps" to the button. So even in the cases where Google does give feedback about an app ban, it is so terse as to be more confusing than informative.

    • an app ban is labelled as "Suspended" in your Google Developer Console listing for your app. Sometimes an app can be labelled "Update Suspended" - this means you still have time to fix the problem and upload another APK. However, the amount of time you have to fix this is indeterminate and unspecified - the app could transition from "Update Suspended" to "Suspended" at any time without further notice (i.e. permanent app ban).

    • if an app has been labelled "Removed" it means it is not available to users now. However, it's removal is NOT affecting the standing of your account (i.e. it is not an app ban, and not contributing towards an account ban). However, I am not sure what happens if too many of your apps are "Removed" - does it lower your resistance to an account ban i.e. you become like the vulnerable single app developers mentioned above - vulnerable to an account ban because of a single further app ban ?

    • sometimes an app ban can be reversed - we posted on reddit, and also appealed to the e-mail address in the e-mail we got for the app ban. The app moved from "Suspended" (app ban) to "Removed" (i.e. not affecting account standing).

    • sometimes a lifetime account ban can be reversed - usually after you have posted on medium dot com, and the blog post goes viral. Sometimes the accounts are reinstated after a few days, sometimes weeks, and in one known case after a year!

    • lifetime account bans generally DO NOT lead to a ban on your Google account (i.e. will not affect your Google Photos etc.) - however, there have been cases with YouTube account bans which DID affect ALL the Google account content (including Google Photos):

    Markiplier's video asking Google that his followers's services still not restored:

    Androiddev post:

     

     

    Can a developer remove an app if he fears it's future ban may imperil his account ? (similarities to slave labor)

    Google does not provide a way for an app developer to remove his app from Google Play.

    A dev can only delete his app from Google Play IF it has been downloaded by zero users.

    A dev CAN "unpublish" his app (from Pricing & Distribution section), however the app remains visible to existing users, and users who have paid for the app.

    However apps you "unpublish" remain liable to app ban - for example an app that is no longer being updated by a developer can fall out of compliance with new rules which Google introduces each year (for example Google no longer honors it's "old apps will always work on newer android versions" compact - every year now apps have to comply with new targetSdkVersion requirements - which means older apps will break and eventually fall out of compliance at a steady pace).

    Devs do occasionally neglect their apps (they may be a hobbyist, a scientists, or simply is swamped by new projects, or the old app may no longer be profitable for them to maintain). However such developers may find that Google is forcing them to update their apps which they have no incentive to update any more.

    Google uses the threat of a lifetime account ban to COMPEL these developers to keep updating their apps (even when devs want not to do so).

    This is a type of compulsion - reminiscent of slave labor - where work is demanded without promise of compensation, or advantage to the worker.

    Essentially a developer once published on Google Play, faces the prospect of lifetime obligation to Google.

    This is odd, given that Google has in the past portrayed itself as an intermediary between the developer and the user, and not as the actual seller of the app - if so it seems odd that Google feels responsible for enforcing a relationship between developer and user. Perhaps Google now does act as actual seller/provider of apps - given that it now also collects taxes directly for more territories (?)

    Recently there was a comment by a Googler (which was also carried by androidpolice) that unpublishing an app will not expose an app to app ban, but that such apps will eventually be "Removed" (as in our app above - see second link at top - ie Removed apps don't put account standing at risk). The androidpolice artice was based on the comment, while the Google commenter was himself at odds with Google docs and said he will get back with others at Google about the discrepancy:

    Here is the original reddit comment that whole androidpolice article is using as source:

     

     

    What is an "associated account ban" ?

    Google's practice of lifetime bans for android developers - bans which percolate from acquaintance to acquaintance. In all likelihood a wife would face an immediate ban if her husband has already been banned - this association would survive divorce:

    An lifetime account ban thus risks making a pariah out of a dev as any potential employer may fear tainting their company account and the accompanying hassle if they hire a tainted developer. Thus the early crimes of a dev could become a lifelong "Scarlet Letter".

     

     

    Why is the Google appeal process flawed ?

    Android developers, once banned, are banned for life - and the only reliable way to get account reinstated is for developer to blog post on medium dot com and achieve virality. Then somehow Google is convinced that the developer's issue has been vetted (for free by the public!) and often restores the account. Even for restored accounts, developers often report that they never found out what led to the account ban in the first place.

    Essentially no human at Google can countermand a Google bot's decision - probably because it is a neural net or uses fuzzy rules to decide - which means it is not explainable in human terms.

    Google also uses secrecy argument - they need secrecy about why they did something to avoid being "gamed" - i.e. they are afraid their automated processes, once known would be easily exploited - as a loophole in an automated system could be used repeatedly, possibly without detection by Google. Google uses this secrecy argument for Adsense and it's other services as well - where Google partners can be banned without them knowing exactly why that happened.

    This developer has created a whole website to document the misbehavior of Google regarding his AdSense account:

    As with most Google "rules" which suffer from the info asymmetry that makes for a "moral hazard" in Google vs partner dealings (app dev/Adsense/YouTubers):

     

     

    Can a lifetime account ban (developer) lead to a GENERAL Google account ban (Google Photos etc.) ?

    Lifetime account bans generally DO NOT lead to a ban on your Google account (i.e. will not affect your Google Photos etc.) - however, there have been cases with YouTube account bans which DID affect ALL the Google account content (including Google Photos):

    Markiplier's video asking Google that his followers's services still not restored:

    Androiddev post:

     

     

    Threats to hobbyist devs and open source developers

    Right now the old advice to new devs to publish early with their test apps, and to do it with abandon is totally the wrong advice now. Generations of android tutorials are hopelessly out of tune with that old advice.

    The current conventional wisdom is to publish carefully, and sparingly with apps which can be supported by the new dev.

    If dev cannot commit to that, they should not post their hobbyists apps to Google Play. This is sound advice to the new hobbyist dev, and to the budding independent dev - if they value their lifetime cred with Google.

    It may surprise you but now even open source app developers are under threat - the other developers who copy and publish with their code are rendering the original app under threat.

     

     

    submitted by /u/stereomatch
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